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PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:13 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:05 am
Posts: 961
Location: Brussels
The frame came to me from the Netherlands (Westerland, way up north) via ebay. The seller said that he thought it was originally a pro-issue bike which would coincide with the last season of the great TI Raleigh team which disbanded at the end of the '83 season when Peter Post switched to Panasonic taking about half the riders with him.

I had originally intended a full restoration and has been in touch with Argos about it (the TI and Panasonic colours are amngst the most requested restorarion colour schemes, apparently). But, when the frame arrived the more I looked at it the more I realised that most of the paint is in pretty good condition, and the more I thought about it I realised I wanted to keep it original if at all possible. I mean, what if it was an actual TI Team issue frame? Just looking at Wikipedia for the TI Raleigh team in 1983 shows the following palmares (wins only):

Ronde van Vlaanderen , Jan Raas
Gent–Wevelgem, Leo van Vliet
Four Days of Dunkirk, Leo van Vliet
Rund um den Henninger-Turm, Ludo Peeters
Paris–Tours, Ludo Peeters
Championship of Zurich, Johan van der Velde
Tour de France: 4 stages (Bert Oosterbosch (2), Peter Winnen, Henk Lubberding), General classification: 3rd (Peter Winnen) and 10th (Henk Lubberding); 1st team classification

- so what if this frame actually participated in some of those races?! Or stretching it even further, what if it actually won any of them??!

I know I'm putting the cart before the horse, but until I'm clearer on the actual history of the frame, then I'm not going for a full restoration. I want to keep the patina, warts'n'all. My mechanic has done a pretty good job of matching the paint so I'm happy with that. I'm planning to take some time treating the rust, then paint over the currently exposed parts, but leave as much of the original paint intact as possible.

Replacement decals are a possibility though, but I'll have to take stock of that once the painting is done. I may well order them in any case so that I'd have them in the event of deciding the current ones are too tatty. I can always choose to go for a full resto at some point in the future, but once that's done then there's no going back to the poriginal paint, and to my mind it's not the same historic bike any more, once that's been done.

Of course, if the frame's race history turns out to be far more mundane, then all the above is moot! I'm in the process of joining http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TI_RALEIGH_TEAM_PROS/ to try to find out more direct information, and will let you know what I find out.

I'll also take some decent pics over the weekend, those ones were taken last night with a mobile phone. The dropouts are indeed drilled, and frm memory I think they're Campagnolo. The frame came with a Hattaswan headset (I'd never heard of then before, but it's excellent quality) and Record BB. The headset has been swapped for the Record on one my Merckx, so the Raleigh will be full Campag as much as possible.

Cheers,
Gareth.


rusty bodie wrote:
DON'T DO IT!!!!!
PLEASE get this lovely old frame PROPERLY renovated!!! honestly, it would be a waste, sacrelege even to get anything less than a professional job done on this rare and wonderful frame!!! try master frame builders like mercian, bob jackson or dave yates - i can recommend all three equally.

check out cyclomondo on ebay for your transfers:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Raleigh-TI-531-75 ... ccessories


now, 753.... i think we are going too deep with this!!

simply *pinggg* any of the maintubes and if they sound like
they are incredibly thin and fragile then you've got a 753! if they go
*THUDDD* like a lead pipe then it something not so exquisite!! could you film
it and put it on youtube perhaps - i could diagnose a 753 much easier that way! lol going by the brazed components and the battered 753 badge it all ties in with the features found on a genuine early 80s special products frame!

the reason your forks have the unusual TI badge was raleigh's
decision alone - no one else to my knowledge had those badges
on the forks and indeed they didn't come with the tubesets available
to the ordinary framebuilders outwith raleigh. personally i never
liked them and indeed on the SB8650 frame that i had in panasonic
colours there were no 753 badges of any description, instead a red
and yellow motif with the raleigh "heron" on.

you have got a cinelli cast bottom bracket and internal fork crown (was it called the CCA? hmm...) and by the look of it prugnat lugs but the original owner must have requested the "shot in" stays as i'm sure that raleigh ilkeston built with the standard side-brazed stays - they certainly did on the larger frames as it was deemed stronger. also you have the under-offset brake cable stops on the top tube - another classic raleigh special products feature. i can't tell from the photos but are they campag dropouts? i know they used simplex for a while but think that was in the raleigh weinmann days of the panasonic colours, from '86 onwards and i'm thinking they might have been drilled for lightness too...now i'm guessing! yours looks like a 21 1/2" or 22" frame, perhaps?

god, where has all this stuff come flooding back from!?! i haven't thought about this for over twenty years!!!!!

luvvit!

where did you find this frame? please tell us all more about it!!

rusty


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:03 pm 
Pumpy's Bear
Pumpy's Bear
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Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2005 10:03 pm
Posts: 8145
Location: Hereford
having seen this frame 'live' I can certainly vouch for it's quality and, for what it is worth, am totally with Gareth in tidying it up rather than a full respray at the moment.

The Hattaswan headset isn't very common but I understand that it is at least Record quality. I also understand that the drilled dropouts indicate that it was a time trial frame (although what's to say that even with that designation some pros decided to use them more generally).

Anyway, iconic frame that should build up into a super sweet bike. I'm not sure that I'm hiding my envy particularly well!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:09 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:43 pm
Posts: 270
I thought you may be interested to see some pcs of my bike - it is bona fide SBDU frame (The frame number is SB7953) from Ilkeston, just that the story is that it was finished as a Carlton rather than a Raleigh.

Surprisingly, mine has the 'tab' under the top tube, which was to hold a racing number. Did Carlton 753s take part in racing ? I'm slightly surprised that your frame doesn't have the tab, but it must be said, that there don't appear to be any set rules for these bikes.


I can't wait to get mine built up. In a way, although my frame is a genuine one as built by the SBDU, I suppose that it isn't as desirable as ones finished in Raleigh colours. Mind you, there is an advantage, in as much I feel that I've more scope in the choice of components that I fit, as it doesn't 'have' to look like 99% of the Raleighs built by the SBDU.


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Last edited by lastpubrunner on Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:14 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:43 pm
Posts: 270
rusty bodie wrote:
DON'T DO IT!!!!!
simply *pinggg* any of the maintubes and if they sound like
they are incredibly thin and fragile then you've got a 753
! if they go
*THUDDD* like a lead pipe then it something not so exquisite!!
rusty


A very good test; my frame certainly 'Pings'.

And my frame also has the under-offset brake cable stops on the top tube that you mentioned.

[img]


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:29 pm 
Old School Hero

Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2010 4:54 pm
Posts: 165
you dont need to ping anything just look in the bottom bracket shell and the tube side walls should be black and of course silver soldered
the seat stays will also be a different taper


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:28 pm 
Old School Hero

Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2008 7:22 pm
Posts: 209
Location: Midlands, UK
Gareth,

You have a superb frame there. I'm at a similar stage at the moment with my SBDU Team Track, still undecided on who's going to do the respray. I must say that Mercian seems a good bet for me.
I will be watching this with interest as I have a 531c Team Replica too which is also 1983 and has the shot in stays as per your frame (looks identical but must be a bit heavier!)

Re Decals, as someone else has mentioned the ones on Ebay seem ok, but they don't seem to cover all of the ones you would need for full replacement. I have been in touch with H Lloyd cycles and they have a superb range of decals, even the small 531 Ti ones on the side of the forks - worth looking at.

As others have said your paint seems mostly ok - given the potential history of your frame I would keep it as is and just get it touched up to prevent rust etc.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:22 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:22 pm
Posts: 1994
Location: North Ayrshire
AndyPA wrote:
you dont need to ping anything just look in the bottom bracket shell and the tube side walls should be black and of course silver soldered
the seat stays will also be a different taper


aye if you can still see from the dirt, oil, rust and grease in there!! lol

:shock:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 5:14 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2010 10:11 pm
Posts: 20
I don't want to hijack the thread - I have been trying to identify a frame and the most unique part is the seat stays and the seatpost clamp. I think it is a really clean, neat way of doing it. On mine the left side is threaded.

If any one could identify the lugs and even better the whole frame ! it could well be a Raleigh.

Image



and all the lugs have the triangular cut out

Image

Shimano and Suntour dropouts

thanks
Andrew

Image


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 7:52 pm 
Retro Guru
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Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 10:50 pm
Posts: 612
Location: Lazy Town
Quote:
Hi folks,
I'm finally (but still slowly!) getting round to building a TI Team replica with the 753 fastback frame I bought last year. I'm having trouble with the seatpost though! I was told that the seat tube was 27.0mm and when it arrived I measured it with a caliper and it read 27.0. All good, so I bought a nice DuraAce post - it's stamped 27.0 on the shaft, and measures 27.0 with the same caliper - but I can't inset it more than ~3cm into the frame! It doesn't clear the minimum insertion level, and just about gets past the bottom of the slot in the seat tube.

What's going on here? Is it possible that the frame is 26.8mm but has been slightly flared out at the top. What size post do I need?? The frame is an SB stamped one from the early 80s, so what would the norm have been back then?


I would be inclined to get a vernier caliper and measure the internal diameter, simples :wink:

Here's one for under a fiver.
http://www.mandp.co.uk/productinfo/5296 ... ue-Vernier

Once you have done that you will know what size seat post you require.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 12:20 am 
Retro Guru

Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:43 pm
Posts: 270
ke35 wrote:
I don't want to hijack the thread - I have been trying to identify a frame and the most unique part is the seat stays and the seatpost clamp. I think it is a really clean, neat way of doing it. On mine the left side is threaded.

If any one could identify the lugs and even better the whole frame ! it could well be a Raleigh.

and all the lugs have the triangular cut out

Shimano and Suntour dropouts

thanks
Andrew


Hi Andrew,

Does the frame have any serial numbers on it - under the bottom bracket ?


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