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PostPosted: Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:33 pm 
rider | rBoTM Winner
rider | rBoTM Winner
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Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2008 1:42 pm
Posts: 5133
Location: Wakefield, Yorkshire
desmondo wrote:
It could be a sixties Freddie Grubb.


60's Claud Butler and Freddie Grubb are basically the same thing, both part of the Holdsworth 'empire' at the time. There were also a few Macleans branded frames out there as well.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 14, 2010 12:23 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:00 pm
Posts: 608
Apologies, only just noticed the new replies here... many thanks!

Quote:
Tell me, does the light boss on the forks look like a later addition? Is there a small square bracket, that looks meaningless on the angled frame tube about four inches down from the headstock, on the r/hand side? No pump pegs?


Can't tell on the light boss, I'm inclined to say it's original. There is a small square-ish shaped braise-on where you say, top side of angled tube, maybe a little more like an upside down trapezium in shape! For band-on shifters?

And yes, it does not have any pump pegs. But Don't think it's a Cordon Bleu looking at the link you provided. Different seat cluster - stays are long and flat on my frame where they meet the cluster. Different rear drop outs and different fork crown.

Think the crown is nervex pro version... "Professional Racing Feature Cut No. 5" fork crown (right); it is noted in text as having a narrow head and being for oval fork blades. ...accoring to classiclightweights.co.uk.

Only other 'new' info I have is I think it needs a 26.2mm seatpost. Does that indicate what the tubing used is in any way?

Judging by responses so far and it seeming fairly standard frame in features, I reckon I'll lean towards a Holdsworth built something or other!!! I'm not overly fussed what it is, more now just deciding whether it's nice enough to invest in having enameled and lug lined somewhere, as it'll need some filing of slight pitting too, or if I should just go for a cheaper paint option?

Thanks again,

Daniel


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 10:05 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:07 pm
Posts: 1324
Location: Cotswolds
Hi, just joined. This frame is in my time warp. Probaly 100's of small builders using Nervex pro, but I saw only one use the Nervex fork crown.
Cheap ends, longish fork rake, could be an Armstrong. In the 1950's Bill Gameson worked there, and it was possible to specifiy fantastic value, but without the spec you would get this. I sold many with 5/8 stays, campagnolo ends, special fittings, and hardly any dearer.
If it takes a 27.2 seat pillar (genuine old word) then its butted tubing, doubt if it's as heavy as 26.2.
The Nervex crown was one of the strongest, but not in fashion.
Keith


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 28, 2010 11:31 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:00 pm
Posts: 608
Thank so much Keith, that's great info.

Just scimmed through an article on Bill Gameson on Classic Lightweights,
http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/builders/gameson-builder.html
Interesting stuff. Be nice if it was one he built! And a few photos of Armstrongs on Classic Rendevous too. Hard to google for Armstrong pics / info without ending up with lots of Lance Armstrong stuff! Do you know anymore? They were a larger manufacturer then?

I'll check the size of seat pillar it takes. I'm sure I measured it as 26.2mm but maybe it's not.

Do you reckon from the serial, 46011, I can assume it to be 1960 then?

Thanks again, Daniel.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 4:00 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:07 pm
Posts: 1324
Location: Cotswolds
Daniel, I don't have frame numbers, but just memories of the 50's and 60's. Your frame could be a standard Armstrong moth, which was sold as a complete bike. I was a local lightweight supplier, and had more interest in well built frames for a reasonable price. Armstrong was part of TI, and was run by Dave Duffield, hence the understanding of bikes. Gameson used silver brazing, but might not be on a production frame. I sold their well specified frames for under £10.
Of course I could be completely wrong, not much to go on.
Most of the bikes here are not retro to me, but look far into the future. My last bike was new end of 1979.
Keith


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