Claud Butler id - hopefully!

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keithglos":32aguq8u said:

The numbers on the bottom bracket casting look like cast in not stamped individually like the frame number. I think 64 is the angle between the seat tube and down tube, very important for the frame builder. Cast lugs could be pulled sometimes up to about 1 degree.
As this angle is now likely to be around 60 on later frames it would mean a higher bottom bracket, on 27s probably 11.25 inches.

Keith

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Very observant Keith, and knowledgeable as usual.
Do you think, with the high BB and lack of braze-ons, that this might have started life as a bespoke single speed grass racer? :?

I would think probably general use club rider. One bike for everything, time trials, occasional grass, probably ride to work.
Just change the wheels and remove mudguards.

I keep being reminded of things I thought I had forgotten. As you know I was a retailer from 1954 to 1966 mostly in the lightweight end of the trade. It was a very much smaller market than you would ever suspect.

Keith

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Hi,
Pull the forks and look for numbers stamped into the steerer tube.
Any number matching one of the numbers stamped into the BB shell will be your serial number.
Once you made sure which is your SN, dating/ID-ing the bike will be a matter of seconds

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I reckon, this is not really a fresh thread, but hey!

I have yet to see a Claud Butler with a serial number stamped into the stem of the downtube on the BB shell, as it is displayed on this bike. (I personally own nearly a dozen of CB-s dating from 1948 to 1956, and all of them have the Serial# stamped into the main body of the bottom bracket (at its lowest region) and into the fork steerer, indeed.)

Lugs and rear dropouts on this frame surely resemble to those of a Claud Butler but the top eye of the seat stays for instance are not typical for that. Neither is the cast BB shell. CB used to have his own shells (presumed pressed) and lugs (even though sometimes design of these were copies to some extent, of branded lugs, such as Nervex-s).

Notwithstanding anything, this frame can almost surely be dated to the late forties, early fifties, based on the lugs and the rear ends (both referred to as 'Continental' back in the day).

Re: Re:

Ghaben1":2x6sjiwr said:

I reckon, this is not really a fresh thread, but hey!

I have yet to see a Claud Butler with a serial number stamped into the stem of the downtube on the BB shell, as it is displayed on this bike. .

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Agreed, I think we'd marked this one up as forever elusive.

I wonder how the OP is getting on in Australia?

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Another mystery Claud Butler is here:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Reyn ... 7675.l2557

Frame number on BB shell and fork steerer looks alright here, though fork crown is not really CB specific. Notwithstanding that, not much Claud Butlers can be found on-line, so it is difficult to compare. Anyway, it is likely an Oct, 1945 CB Continental Club frame.

Re: Re:

Ghaben1":6iag6rxq said:

Another mystery Claud Butler is here:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Reyn ... 7675.l2557

Frame number on BB shell and fork steerer looks alright here, though fork crown is not really CB specific. Notwithstanding that, not much Claud Butlers can be found on-line, so it is difficult to compare. Anyway, it is likely an Oct, 1945 CB Continental Club frame.

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I certainly am inclined to agree on the date, it would certainly help back up the assumption that production numbers were low in 1945