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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:22 am 
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I disagree. I love my On-one 456. But its steel so more old school than modern stuff usually is.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:28 am 
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To be honest, while I agree that there is some tat out there, all this hatred that is spouted for "Modern Bikes" is, in the most part, utter drivel!!!

Attention to detail? Please!
Look at the design and manufacturing that has gone into that SantaCrus sull suss above.... 20 years ago, full suss was at best, flexy, wobbly, unpredicatable and used straight pipes

Function over form? Please!
I would rather have something that does what it is designed to do, consistently, and relaiably, than to be at best OK, but look pretty (Wife? :wink: )

Rose tinted blinkers :roll:



G


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:44 am 
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There's a misconception here, Not all modern bikes are ugly.
But I'm going to be cruel and be honest enough to say that in my humble opinion all jump bikes must've jumped off the ugly tree upon conception :D

And come on re the Santa Cruz, not all spaceships and sci fi creations look good, ;) though the one above isn't the completely ugly type I was talking about, though its front end looks like it belongs in a bike version of TOWE.

To be honest, sure most modern bike designers try too hard, and fail, not all, most!

As I said above, sure you'll be able to traverse a glacier in one or to give another example, jump of Mount Everest but truthfully how's many mtb riders and owners actually need all that and compete?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:50 am 
King of the Skip Monkeys
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unkleGsif wrote:
To be honest, while I agree that there is some tat out there, all this hatred that is spouted for "Modern Bikes" is, in the most part, utter drivel!!!

Attention to detail? Please!
Look at the design and manufacturing that has gone into that SantaCrus sull suss above.... 20 years ago, full suss was at best, flexy, wobbly, unpredicatable and used straight pipes

Function over form? Please!
I would rather have something that does what it is designed to do, consistently, and relaiably, than to be at best OK, but look pretty (Wife? :wink: )

Rose tinted blinkers :roll:



G


Work as a mechanic in a bike shop - just 6 months should do it, then you may change your outlook.

Its not really a 'hate' of modern bikes, I suspect its more to do with the faceless business practices of what is now a dwindling side of the industry. The companies exist for no other reason than to make money, that is all.

Very very few companies may have other motives but its these bland megacorps that have kind of taken the innocence out of cycling. Its not even rose tinted, why do you feel that you 'need' suspension? Its because its everywhere and the magazines tell you that you 'need' XYZ for this season. Bikes look great to the casual rider and to keep up with Johnny, they must have that XYZ or at least some similar. Its just basic marketing.

Cycling as a whole can be very very simple. Simple doesnt sell, 'tech' sells, the latest trumped up must have sells. Just look at Apple products as a prime example. A fairly stale market suddenly shaken to its core by one product and now everyone has to have that product or something similar whether its needed or not.

Its great to have the newest, sure, there will always be those that want it (and perhaps have fallen under the spell) but there are those that visited that country, enjoyed its hospitality and have now gone 'home'.

RetriBIKE is to many that 'home'. Simple bikes, easy to maintain, fun to use with any headaches easy to repair or replace.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:00 am 
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Location: muddy fields, usually
unkleGsif wrote:
To be honest, while I agree that there is some tat out there, all this hatred that is spouted for "Modern Bikes" is, in the most part, utter drivel!!!

Attention to detail? Please!
Look at the design and manufacturing that has gone into that SantaCrus sull suss above.... 20 years ago, full suss was at best, flexy, wobbly, unpredicatable and used straight pipes

Function over form? Please!
I would rather have something that does what it is designed to do, consistently, and relaiably, than to be at best OK, but look pretty (Wife? :wink: )

Rose tinted blinkers :roll:



G

Don't get me wrong, I love the nostalgia for the age in which I grew up utterly obsessed by mountain bikes of that day, but this^.

Never forget that old-school Marins, Konas, Specializeds, Oranges, etc, were all mass-produced in the far east, just as they are today. Take away the paintjobs and most retro bikes from the early 90's are almost indistinguishable from each other except to true enthusiasts. Maybe a wishbone stay here or there, the style of dropouts, the cable routing... Get ten retro frames all kitted up with the same components and in a blind test you'd struggle to tell them apart.

Modern FS designs are, on the other hand, almost instantly identifiable, and have very different ride characteristics (I'm told) - FSR is very active but supportive, VPP such as Giant's Maestro tend to blow through midrange travel very quickly with a standard tune shock, single pivots suffer from brake jack, etc, etc...

There is far more scope for picking exactly the type of bike for the riding you do, whereas 20 years ago you could maybe choose 60mm of front suspension if you were lucky enough to be able to afford it.

Want a skinny-tubed steel frame? On-One, Cotic, Charge, Dialled Bikes, Sanderson and Pipedream all make them, and that's just UK companies. Hope are still making boutique machined hubs and brakes, and there's a myriad of US companies still producing gorgeous CNC stuff. You can still build a very retro-looking bike from brand new components if you want, and it will cost comparably what a boutique build would have back then. Just because it's not what the masses want (or think they want!), doesn't mean it's not out there...

:)


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:07 am 
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Having spent many years as a cycle mechanic I could see the difference over time...when I say attention to detail I'm referring to the quality of paint, welds etc. Cannondale had changed greatly between '94 and '06 when I left the trade.

There are still plenty of modern bikes out there that I like and I'm sure the quality is there, however some are not so.

As such I'd give pretty much anything to have my Roberts or Pace back.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:08 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 9:48 pm
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Location: Bad Dürkheim(Rhein-Pflaz) Germany
Too many stickers/graphics and bling on today's bikes. They're way too busy-looking. I like to see naked metal, the craftsmanship is what counts. I like to see welds, and mechanisms and such.

For the most part, i'm function over form.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:19 am 
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malt wrote:
Having spent many years as a cycle mechanic I could see the difference over time...when I say attention to detail I'm referring to the quality of paint, welds etc. Cannondale had changed greatly between '94 and '06 when I left the trade.

There are still plenty of modern bikes out there that I like and I'm sure the quality is there, however some are not so.

As such I'd give pretty much anything to have my Roberts or Pace back.


I understand what you mean!

Of course there are many nice looking bikes, some beautiful ones, you have some glorious looking steel and titanium bikes too, especially those built by boutique firms or in house frame builders - but most are over sized inelegant wannabe motor cycles. even the suspension forks are virtually indistinguishable - they all seem generic - apart from the decals.

I just wanted to make sure friends here know that I'm just expressing an opinion, and merely lamenting the passing of traditional looks and care - and no offence to anyone who has a modern bike!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:42 am 
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Joined: Thu May 27, 2010 1:20 pm
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If we compare like for like then yes they are all ugly in comparison with their ancestors. And even worse, they all look the same.

Take a look at a 2012 Kona, Specialized, Marin, Scott, Trek et al. They all look the bloody same. Boring, basic colours, with stripy stickers.

A Facebook friend posted a pic of his new road bike yesterday - I couldn't actually tell what make it was.

Look back 20 years. Even the cheaper models, the Rockhoppers, Lava Domes and Bear Valleys all had their own distinct style.

I realise a lot of it is down to the industry reaching a design zenith. The curved downtube, regular stays, long travel, aluminium frame is the best, most cost effective way to do bikes but they could still employ some designers to give each bike it's own identity.

I guess we were just lucky to be around when the manufacturers were still experimenting. E-stays, steel, various alloys, different angles. We were lucky.

I feel sorry for the kids today, all essentially riding exactly the same bloody bike!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:29 pm 
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There are plenty of gop-ugly old bikes too.


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