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 Post subject: Re: Is Retro faster?
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:07 pm 
Old School Grand Master

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:42 am
Posts: 3117
al-onestare wrote:
mattr wrote:
al-onestare wrote:
These bikes are ill-suited for single-track in every respect; too heavy, poorly geared and cumbersome.
So, shit bikes then?


No. Not at all.

al-onestare wrote:
Their bikes are perfectly suited for bike parks and enduro's.... you just need to use them in the right environment to get the best out of them.
They sound extremely shit for a modern bike.
Or maybe you are just trying to compare apples and kitkats?

An iron horse is ill suited to single track, what with being heavy and cumbersome. And usually poorly geared. So therefore all retros are slow.
QED.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:19 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2014 5:25 am
Posts: 53
Location: Idaho
I don't know if faster is the right word?

The man is the power plant/skill-set. A smoother Stronger bike makes the man more confident to push the limits of more Speed?

It's not that Retro Bikes are slow by any means period.

It's just all about if you've got the "BALLS" when your do'n 30+ downhill and there's a Switch-Back turn coming up, when your gonna attempt to shut down the Steel Frame'd, V-Brake'n, Ridged Fork'd, Nose to the Straight Handlebar BEAST! :shock: Before bitting the dust.

Some of the Newer upper-end MTB are pretty wicked.


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 Post subject: Re: Is Retro faster?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 1:41 pm 
Old School Grand Master
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Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:16 pm
Posts: 5287
mattr wrote:
They sound extremely shit for a modern bike.
Or maybe you are just trying to compare apples and kitkats?

An iron horse is ill suited to single track, what with being heavy and cumbersome. And usually poorly geared. So therefore all retros are slow.
QED.


I think we're on the same page, just articulating it differently. I was a bit harsh to say modern bikes inadequate in every way, but I do believe the really janky epic terrain is their forte.

Again, none of this is rocket science, contrary to what some of the mountain bike media would have us believe.


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 Post subject: Re: Is Retro faster?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 1:59 pm 
Old School Grand Master

Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:42 am
Posts: 3117
al-onestare wrote:
I think we're on the same page, just articulating it differently.
Quite possibly, you're comparing something that could be called a retro XC race bike (as many of them were) with a modern long wheel base trail bike, geared up for mamils (or possibly Middle Aged Men in MX Pajamas) to ride round a trail centre. Whilst actually doing little or nothing more than could easily be achieved on a 20 year old HT.


My evolution of best or race bike has gone from a rigid trek steel in 91 (970 IIRC) via a couple of Raleigh Torus Team bikes (95 and 99), then Scott Scale (2009) and now Canyon Lux 29er, my first XC FS (bought last year) none of them are at all cumbersome or awkward on technical singletrack, as that is what they are built for. None of them were heavy either (for their era anyway) or cumbersome, and gears have barely changed, other than the increasing range at the back, and reducing range at the front (wide range triple, to narrower range triple, to double, single holds no interest for me until they can eliminate the massive ratio steps)

I'm completely uninterested in the marketing drive for everyone to buy long low and slack for "railing the descents", as they are shit at climbing and technical singletrack (unless you have the speed to crash through it), and a pain in the arse to wind up on the fast bits, unless you have gradient on your side.

On the other hand, long low and slack is selling hand over fist. So you are very likely to come across people riding them. Short sharp pointy XC bikes aren't.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 3:28 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:08 pm
Posts: 1881
Location: I know where the stash is – the secret's safe with me. The flying squad will never find us...
Any fool can drive to a bike park and go downhill fast with slacking modern full suspension. But it takes skill, fitness, technique and stamina to be an all-round rider of climbing, trails, endurance and technical stuff. Obviously, you're not going to be able to ride railing descents on a fully rigid bike from the era of ATBs, particularly if one is a 50-something bloke...


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 3:48 pm 
Gold Trader / PoTM Winner / RB Rider
Gold Trader / PoTM Winner / RB Rider
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Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:13 pm
Posts: 5629
Location: Royal Forest of Dean (Still looking for the Bear !)
Not sure if this has come up on earlier pages.... so forgive me if they have

theres tons of comparison on line, how bang on they are is subjective ......you to decide,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOlc0a2eVTo





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APz7mt9jYw4



Last edited by Retro Spud on Tue Jun 26, 2018 3:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 3:54 pm 
Retro Guru

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:08 pm
Posts: 1881
Location: I know where the stash is – the secret's safe with me. The flying squad will never find us...
Love these videos. I'd probably brain myself trying that on my 28 year old rigid Clockwork!


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 4:01 pm 
Dirt Disciple

Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2014 5:25 am
Posts: 53
Location: Idaho
Quote:
Any fool can drive to a bike park and go downhill fast with slacking modern full suspension. But it takes skill, fitness, technique and stamina to be an all-round rider of climbing, trails, endurance and technical stuff. Obviously, you're not going to be able to ride railing descents on a fully rigid bike from the era of ATBs, particularly if one is a 50-something bloke...



riiiiight... thats the right answer right there. :lol:

I mean, is there an all around bike?

IMO the Hardtail is the best all-arounder bike, just hit the streets to the trail and unlock the fork shock on the trail. You can lock both shocks on a modern FS but it's twice the price, maintenance, can be complex ect...


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 Post subject: Re: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 4:07 pm 
Gold Trader / MacRetro rider
Gold Trader / MacRetro rider

Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 10:05 pm
Posts: 7540
Location: Aberdeen
groovyblueshed wrote:
Any fool can drive to a bike park and go downhill fast with slacking modern full suspension.


No they can't, they really can't.
See below....

groovyblueshed wrote:
But it takes skill, fitness, technique and stamina


Yep. It still takes all those things too.


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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 9:55 pm 
retrobike rider / Gold Trader
retrobike rider / Gold Trader
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Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:13 pm
Posts: 10848
Location: Skipton
Some of you lot really need to come out of the bunker and have a decent go on a few modern bikes as your assessments are way off from what I have experienced.


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